Why We Say “I’m Fine” When We Are Not: The Psychology of Hiding Your True Feelings
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Welcome to the original self podcast. I'm Evet
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DeCota, owner of DeCota Life Coaching and a psychology
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informed life coach. I explore resilience, mindset,
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and the courage to become your authentic self.
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This is a space for honest conversations about
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growth, identity, relationships, and all the
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messy moments in between that shape who we become.
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Between the salon chair and coaching sessions,
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I've watched people move through life in patterns
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they never notice. Patterns that are subtle or
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familiar and often incredibly hard to see from
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the inside. Today, we're talking about the most
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automatic answer most of us give when someone
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asks how we're doing. I'm fine, and how it rarely
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tells the truth. This episode 11, why we say
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I'm fine when we're not, the psychology of hiding
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our true feelings is coming up. In America, We
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greet each other with, hello, how are you? And
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the expected response is supposed to be, I'm
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fine, how are you? Either way, the answer rarely
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reflects what you're truly feeling underneath
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the surface. And it's not really supposed to,
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it's just a greeting. If I had a dollar for every
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time I said I was fine when I felt angry or overwhelmed
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or possibly having a panic attack, I'd be very
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wealthy right now. But why do we do that? Of
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course most of us don't want to unload our problems
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on the cashier or a co -worker and we learn really
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quickly that people are not usually expecting
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a real answer. So the problem isn't fine in casual
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moments. It's when we go home and talk to people
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who we genuinely love or genuinely love us and
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say we're fine or we sit across from someone
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who truly cares about how we feel and the answer
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is still fine. So why do many of us walk around
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saying we're fine when we're actually anything
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but? It's not weakness. It's not dishonesty.
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I think it's something far more human than that.
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I believe I started doing it at a young age.
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Maybe starting with my bone disease. I was born
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into a body that broke easily. Sometimes from
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things other kids would have totally walked away
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from. And every time the message at home was
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exactly the same. You're fine. You'll live. Walk
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it off. Provided it wasn't my leg. So I did it.
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I did it every time. And there's something powerful
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about being told you're fine when your bones
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are literally breaking. It makes you learn at
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a very young age that your pain is not the point.
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What matters is getting up and moving on and
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not making too much of it, right? And if you
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think about it, it wasn't such a bad way of coping
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with it and not letting it define me. Because
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of this though, I learned to minimize my feelings
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at school as well. I didn't want pity. I didn't
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want to be seen as fragile or different. So I
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acted like it was no big deal and people followed
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my lead most of the time. If I didn't make a
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fuss about it, they didn't do it either. What
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I didn't realize was that I was practicing something.
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Every time I minimized my bones breaking, I was
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reinforcing the idea that my pain mattered less
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than how other people perceived me. That's heavy
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for a little kid, and so I didn't get it, right?
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Then came the teasing about brittle bones, my
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weight, about being different. And it was the
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kind of casual cruelty kids can deliver without
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anyone noticing how deeply it lands inside of
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you. I became very good at crying in private,
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pulling myself together, and walking back out
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as if nothing had happened. Eventually, it kind
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of became my template for everything. I'm fine.
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I'll live. Move on. All of this performing prepared
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me for the very big things in my life. My best
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friend dying in our twenties. It severely shut
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down my emotions because I wasn't practiced at
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grieving openly. So I carried it inside alone
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quietly. Or the man that I loved deeply who didn't
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love me enough to choose me. And I chose to deal
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with that in silence because what do you do with
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pain that big when you never learned how to say
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it out loud? The real truth is I just let the
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love go because it terrified me to be that vulnerable
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and needy. The armor that I had constructed had
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protected me for years and it also made me invisible.
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I think even to myself. And here's the hardest
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part to explain. For me, after a while, I wasn't
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performing fine any longer. I genuinely couldn't
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locate the pain. I had buried it so deeply that
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I would have told you honestly that I was okay,
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that there was nothing to talk about. That's
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what long -term fine does to someone, to someone's
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emotions and expressions. expressing their emotions.
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It doesn't just hide your feelings from other
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people, it eventually hides it from yourself.
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Before I bring my guest in for this podcast today,
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I want to say one thing briefly because I think
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it explains what you're about to hear. A sociologist
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named Irving Goffman believed that everyday life
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was kind of a performance. He called it impression
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management. He said that we all have a front
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stage the version of ourselves that we present
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to the world and Then there's a backstage who
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we actually are when no one is watching I'm fine
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is one of the most rehearsed front stage lines
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So knowing that we'll come back to the psychology
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behind that during the interview But first I
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want you to meet someone who is choosing, maybe
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for the first time in his life, to stop performing
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fine. My nephew calls me Annie because when he
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was little he missed the T in Auntie and it stuck.
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He's 17 now, an athlete, a good student, he's
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funny, he's charming, he's super good looking,
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and by most standards the kind of kid who seems
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completely fine. He's also one of the most guarded
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people I know. And I say that lovingly because
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I recognize it completely. I'm not only his Annie,
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I'm also his friend. And I know where he learned
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to perform that fine. He learned it from us.
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Two years ago my nephew lost his mom to colon
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cancer. She was my sister -in -law, my sissy.
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And in the aftermath of her death, the family
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fractured in ways that we're all still trying
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to understand. At 15 years old, my nephew was
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left carrying enormous grief inside a life that
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no longer felt stable. He saw a therapist for
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a while, but through his own admission, he spent
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most of this session avoiding what he actually
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really felt. He hated going. He called it pointless.
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He joked to me that the therapist was a forced
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friend so we started calling her FF. It was our
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own private laugh but underneath those jokes
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his emotions were far too raw to let anyone in.
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Then his first real relationship ended and something
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inside him just cracked open. For the first time
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in his life I watched my nephew Begin letting
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go of the persona that he had built up around
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all the emotions that he couldn't show anybody
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a Few weeks ago during a conversation between
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the two of us. He asked me if he could come on
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this podcast I said yes before he even finished
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the sentence What you're about to hear is a 17
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year old young man choosing Maybe for the first
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time in his life to stop performing fine I'm
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not here to polish it or steer it too much it's
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just going to be his Annie and some questions
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and We're gonna let him be exactly who he is
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So hello my little nephew Jackson when um, how's
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it going? Hi, are you excited to do this? Yeah,
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I am pretty stoked. All right, cool so I'm gonna
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ask you a question and When people ask you how
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you're doing, what do you tell them typically?
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I feel like it's a pretty auto response kind
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of like robotic at this point. It's like and
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I'm fine or and I'm okay or you know if the day
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was better than it normally is it's a you know
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my day was good but it's never like I never go
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deep into like what I actually feel because I
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feel like number one like a lot of people even
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though they say they want to listen to that I
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feel like coming from me it's like I don't know
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I wouldn't when I ask someone that I'm not trying
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to sit there for 30 minutes and like kind of
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full listen sure sure sure sure yeah I mean you
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don't want to like you know tell a perfect stranger
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well I've had a really bad day today right like
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you don't really go into it right um is it ever
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the truth when somebody says like hey how you
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doing is it ever the truth some most of the time
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I would say it is the truth you know a lot of
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time At the end of the day or something like
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I am just fine like it's been a lot of ups and
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downs throughout the day So it's like it's never
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really one emotion But like sometimes there has
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been some low points that I don't speak about
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but normally if there's like a high point I bring
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it up in conversation somehow later in the night
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or during that so you feel comfortable with some
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people Yeah, I mean it really depends on on who
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like for example my last relationship like if
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she would ask me how I was doing I would be more
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honest, you know, there was Some i'm fine some
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i'm okay thrown in there but you know It was
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more if I had a rough day I tell her I had a
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rough day, but I feel like with the parents and
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friends It's more easy in a way to just be like,
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you know, i'm fine and leave it at that Yeah,
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that makes sense It is easier What you just described
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has a name and I talked about it earlier in the
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podcast. It's called impression management, meaning
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it's we all have this performance version of
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ourselves for anybody watching. So most of us
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learn which emotions are maybe feel the safest
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or like OK to put forward, right? We're not people
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are not going to just judge us. So when we say
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I'm fine, that's like one of the most rehearsed
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lines. It's the easiest one to say. The thing
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is, is the more we rehearse it of saying, I'm
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fine all the time, the more it becomes automatic,
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right? And we don't talk about our true feelings.
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Does that make sense? Yeah, exactly. Yeah. All
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right, so before this relationship, Had you ever
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let anyone a friend your family whatever? Had
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you ever let anyone get very close to you? Yeah,
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I have a you know, I kind of see him as a brother
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at this point Like I say his name obviously,
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but he's very close to me and he transferred
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schools This year so that was kind of hard. But
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you know, we still talk like he's one of my mainest
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friends like I've had him since like honestly
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I didn't know him at the time. It was like that
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there's like a Kind of a like a superstition
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is the word where it's like It's like the meeting
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someone twice there. You meet him once They don't
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really mean anything to you. You don't really
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understand it You don't know them and the second
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time you meet him you like connect and you click
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instantaneously and that's kind of what happened
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with us He was on my flag football team As a
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kid and you know, I never thought I would see
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him again then he came to our school and we kind
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of butted heads for the first little bit while
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he was at school and then you know, we just clicked
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and everything went from there and you know,
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he's been my one of my best friends ever since
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and You know, I do think of him as like someone
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I could tell kind of anything I want because
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it's like without him their school would have
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been a lot more rough sophomore freshman year
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and You know that's kind of where The relationship
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kind of like hurt the most is because when he
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left She kind of filled that void in a way like
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she made it seem like What I even made it seem
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like she was my best friend, you know anyone
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I could talk to at school If I was feeling okay,
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like, you know, I could always go talk to her
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See her on break. So it's kind of like the same
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thing like because me and him would always walk
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to class together And even if we didn't have
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the same class, you know just chat the whole
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time and you know That's kind of what we did
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this year. So that's what it makes this one sting
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a lot more Yeah, absolutely Well, I mean not
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that your buddy was your first love But I mean
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when you have a first love or like a first really
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deep relationship it changes you like it allows
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you to be who you really really are and Dr. Brené
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Brown. She's like my favorite scientist. She
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does work on vulnerability and shame she talks
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about how We carry this quiet fear of of showing
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people who we really are right like we just talked
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about so we perform strength instead right and
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there's a distinction where the strength shows
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up as armor not resilience does that make sense
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yeah right so like you know think about like
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in the in the dark ages, the chain mail that
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people wore, right? Like it totally protects
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you. But then that chain mail becomes like a
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skin, like an additional skin. And we just have
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this like what you were saying to me a while
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ago, like this persona that we keep putting out.
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So when you are friends or you still are friends
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with this guy, right? That kind of allows you
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to be the person that you are. And when you were
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with your girlfriend, it allows you To be as
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as as truthful and who you are as as you want
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to be. Yeah Yeah, yeah, so You've told me before
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but you just kind of mentioned that you were
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completely open with your ex -girlfriend You
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know most most of the time I think Transparent
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in a way that maybe you weren't with everybody
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else except for your your buddy What made that
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possible? Um, you know, it wasn't a an all -the
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-time thing, you know, I wasn't always Transparent
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there was a lot of times that actually I wasn't
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Transparent just about you know life in general
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like it'd be over the littlest things. It'd be
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like, you know, like I Don't know how much money
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I had or something It was just it was stuff to
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make me seem like quote -unquote cooler and quote
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-unquote like, you know I had this like unlimited
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like income even though like Obviously that's
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not true, especially as a 17 year old, but it's
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like When I was truthful it was because it was
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so happy that I didn't need to be that way and
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it was like for example, like, you know, we would
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be hanging out and it would just be me and her
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and let's say we're going on like a an ice cream
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run at night and it's like it's just us like
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those are the moments where I am the most transparent
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because it's like that's who I am like Those
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car rides that we would have together like we're
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just like laughing having fun singing the music
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together like that's kind of like who I am as
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a person like, you know and when it wasn't me
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it was because I There's like this term that
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younger kids use it's like nonchalant and or
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full and I have a reputation at school that you
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know, I'm kind of nonchalant kind of or full
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and it's like I didn't want to ruin that perception
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of me because I liked quote -unquote like who
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that was and like looking back like you know
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all I wish I did was like not be nonchalant because
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it's like Nonchalant means that you show that
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you don't care about anything and not caring
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about anything is what makes people cool but
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honestly like Not caring about stuff just makes
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you like lame in a way because it's like you
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don't show any passions You don't you don't show
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any love or interest for others and people because
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it's like you're too busy trying to put up this
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facade that you don't care when really like you
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probably do care. Yeah. What did you say? Or
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oracle? Yeah, oracle. I never heard that oracle.
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It's like, you know, you have like an aura about
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you. Oh, oracle. OK. Yeah. I'm not quite sure
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that's a word, but I like it. I like the phrase.
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So when you said that you were. Like that's who
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you are, like easy. Like that's what I got out
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of that. You didn't say easy, but like you were
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having fun and singing songs and things like
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that. When you decided to put on the cool persona
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or the auraful, I'm gonna keep using it, what
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do you think changed? Like why did you go to
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that? Honestly, it's kind of like, it's like
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a lot of the, like a thing at school, like kind
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of an escape, I would say. Because it's like
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at school. I don't know I really don't know why
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I would go to it and that's something i'm still
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kind of working through and You know i'm doing
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it a lot less like the other day. I you know
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me my boy We're just like sitting there And I
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realize like I don't really participate in many
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school assemblies or the school games and i'm
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like, you know like why is that like why am I
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afraid to Like go down there and have fun. So
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we just kind of like we just went down there
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We had fun and we won it and like, you know that
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was like way more fun than just like sitting
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in the crowd and kind of like Making fun of the
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people that do go up there because it's like
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it's like yeah It's way easier to sit back and
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like call them weird because they are going up
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there and they're showing who they are But to
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actually do it it's a lot more fun than you would
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think like yeah, maybe maybe some people You
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know like sat there and made fun of us for going
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up there and having a good time But it's like,
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you know who cares like I went up there and I
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had a good time So why do I care about what they
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think and it's like to go back to the question
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about like Why did I put up that facade? It's
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cuz I don't know. I just I wanted to seem Cooler
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I wanted to seem like, you know Nothing affects
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me. Nothing. Nothing hurts me Life's perfect,
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you know, just that that whole that whole facade
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I feel like a lot of people put up to this day
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and I feel like if you can break down You know
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your true actions and what you actually care
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about and do those things then you'll be so much
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happier than Putting up that facade because even
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if I continue to put up that facade and continue
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to act that way, you know Like yeah, I would
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seem cool. Yeah, I would you know have these
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friends and stuff, but it's like um I don't know.
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I just it's it's a lot more Enjoyable to live
00:21:16
life how you actually want to live it instead
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of you know, putting up that false front. Yeah
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Do you think that? you put that facade up that
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cool facade like where do you think that came
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from or Did you also have friends that would
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judge people for that like you learned from them?
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Saying oh, that's lame or that's not cool. Like
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I'm wondering where it came from. Yeah No, I
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mean everyone has friends, you know, everyone
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does that, you know, you know I love all my boys
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like, you know, they're my boys for a reason
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so I'm not gonna like diss them but you know
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that is that is like Boy culture nowadays and
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that happens with people that you know, I wouldn't
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even say are in my Direct friend group. It's
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like you just put each other down for no reason
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I'm like and I realize that you put each other
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down because you don't want to seem interested
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in a thing so it's like that's where the nonchalant
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is comes from and that's where that facade comes
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from it's because you want to seem cool you want
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to seem like You know, you want you want to attract
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others by doing that when rather, you know I
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kind of wish I had memorized the quote before
00:22:24
I came in here, but it's like there's a quote
00:22:26
That's like like stand out It's better to stand
00:22:29
alone in something you enjoy than to be a part
00:22:31
of a crowd of something you don't like and it's
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like That's kind of exactly how it is, you know
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I would never trade my friends for anyone else
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because you know there my rider dies, but it's
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like You know my friends I became into that group
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and became very invested in that group by putting
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others down like that's how you kind of built
00:22:48
your way up the The pyramid I would say of the
00:22:51
friend group is by you know How many jokes you
00:22:55
can get off how much you can make others laugh
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and I feel like a lot of friend groups are like
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that. It's like Normally the yeah the the top
00:23:02
friend like the the friend of everyone is normally
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the friend that can make everyone laugh and like
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make everyone have a good time and enjoy themselves
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so it's like to be able to be like that is like
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to be the most nonchalant to be the You know
00:23:17
the quote -unquote meanest one and it's you know,
00:23:20
it's like I did that for a while, you know, I'd
00:23:23
I'd not not Happy to admit it and not proud of
00:23:27
it. But you know definitely put others down and
00:23:30
you know definitely made little digs at people
00:23:33
all the time and it's like that's kind of like
00:23:37
I don't know that that's just it's very normalized
00:23:39
for a teenage boy and maybe I don't know about
00:23:42
anyone else but I do I can speak on teenage boys
00:23:44
and it's like that's kind of the norm is to do
00:23:46
that so you know, I do get called corny nowadays
00:23:50
because you know, I no longer do that and I After
00:23:53
these like, you know past few weeks, you know,
00:23:55
I've kind of fully changed how I act especially
00:23:58
in classes like no longer like trying to make
00:24:01
like jokes about people and kind of trying to
00:24:04
make a joke about like the the atmosphere or
00:24:07
like the situation instead of like insulting
00:24:10
someone's like not character because I would
00:24:13
never go that far, but it's like Insulting someone's
00:24:15
actions because you never know how much that's
00:24:18
gonna impact someone like speaking from example
00:24:20
I was driving one of my uh, my friends one time
00:24:24
and like a kind of older song came on and like,
00:24:28
you know It meant no harm, but I loved the song
00:24:30
and it was like he just called that like yo Like
00:24:32
what are you an unc like obviously it was just
00:24:34
a joke, but it like It made me kind of think
00:24:37
more about like what I would play in those situations,
00:24:41
like what kind of music I would play, like trying
00:24:43
to play like the the newer songs, the more underground
00:24:47
songs, because I'm trying to seem cooler. Got
00:24:49
it. Yeah. And just because he didn't like that
00:24:52
song, then then that means that you were. too
00:24:55
old school or yeah exactly enough okay got it
00:24:58
well it was probably a really good song I was
00:25:01
gonna say something to you like you were saying
00:25:03
like about going up and playing this game you
00:25:06
know at school which hopefully they got pictures
00:25:09
of because I never see pictures of you and it's
00:25:12
too it's too bad anyways Theodore Roosevelt he's
00:25:16
you know, obviously an older ex -president, but
00:25:19
he did this speech called man in the arena and
00:25:23
it's about how okay, you're in the arena, right
00:25:28
the spectators are all around you and You throw
00:25:32
your hat in and you you're like Sweating and
00:25:35
blood and and all this stuff and you're fighting
00:25:38
and you've thrown everything in there you thrown
00:25:40
caution to the wind And there's always the spectators,
00:25:45
always the naysayers that are like, oh, I could
00:25:48
do that better. Like, oh, he looks foolish for
00:25:50
doing that. But they've never had the vulnerability
00:25:55
and the courage to throw their hat in. And so
00:25:59
today, when you went up and you played that game
00:26:01
or this week when you did that, that's like straight
00:26:05
up saying, yeah, this is me. This is what I'm
00:26:08
going to do. Yeah, exactly. Ace is for you. So
00:26:13
you did do that with your ex a lot of times not
00:26:16
all the time I would say it was like a Honestly,
00:26:21
it's kind of bad to look back and admit but it
00:26:23
I feel like it is a majority of a facade and
00:26:27
less of you know kind of who I was Because I
00:26:31
felt like I needed I don't know in a way I needed
00:26:34
the facade to keep her but actually that That
00:26:38
facade and not being able to you know be in touch
00:26:41
With my emotions and being touched like why I
00:26:45
feel certain ways about things in my own opinions
00:26:48
it's like not being able to I Don't know. I don't
00:26:52
I can't remember the word for but like not being
00:26:54
able to put my true self out there is what in
00:26:57
turn, you know lost her in a way because you
00:27:01
know, I I wasn't I wasn't the man that I should
00:27:05
have been to her because she was very like loving
00:27:08
with me and I was loving back but in a way like
00:27:11
You know, I think we can maybe get into it later,
00:27:14
but you know Just there was like little stuff
00:27:17
that you know if I done it would have shown that
00:27:20
I cared a lot more instead of that That facade
00:27:23
that you know, I don't care. I'm too cool for
00:27:25
this. I'm too cool for that. It's like It's just
00:27:29
a lot of that. Yeah It's interesting When we
00:27:34
were talking before you we were talking about
00:27:37
you know you being in love and You know, like
00:27:42
I said a part of you emerges right where another
00:27:45
person sees you but it sounds to me like You
00:27:50
didn't let her see the real you a lot of the
00:27:53
time. Yeah. Yeah What's that feel like now? Oh,
00:27:57
it hurts honestly because it's like You know,
00:28:01
we've talked a few times since then it doesn't
00:28:04
it's not like a lot of people might think like
00:28:07
like high school love doesn't really mean much
00:28:09
but It did mean a lot to me and I can see that
00:28:14
by how much I've reflected and changed myself
00:28:19
over the past few weeks. Sorry, what was the
00:28:24
question again? I got lost. It's okay. I said
00:28:27
that you had the opportunity. You know for a
00:28:33
couple years to show her who you really were
00:28:36
and I'm sure you did show her but you know like
00:28:39
you You needed to put up that front and I'm wondering
00:28:43
why with her you needed to put up that front
00:28:45
I don't know I think it all stems back to the
00:28:49
you know trying to be cool because she had a
00:28:51
little brother and her little brother really
00:28:53
looked up to me So I felt like the cooler I acted
00:28:57
Around them around her and even when it was one
00:28:59
-on -one, you know, I'd still try and act like
00:29:00
that cool. Like I don't care facade Because I
00:29:04
think I was so deep into the act of it that I
00:29:08
couldn't even see that it was an act and that's
00:29:12
the biggest thing I think I'm kind of looking
00:29:15
back on right now is I Couldn't back then like,
00:29:18
you know, I didn't know that was a facade I didn't
00:29:21
know I was just trying to act like that. I just
00:29:23
acted like that and You know, I'm not saying
00:29:26
to go get your heart broken to figure it out
00:29:28
But to figure it out is really nice because you
00:29:31
know I can see Who I truly am now and you know,
00:29:35
I'm not the same guy and that doesn't mean that
00:29:38
You know, I'm gonna she's gonna run back to me
00:29:41
because I'm a changed man But it's like because
00:29:43
it's it's not for her that I changed I just realized
00:29:46
that you know, I didn't like the path that I
00:29:48
was on I didn't like who I was becoming and us
00:29:52
that doesn't have to do with you know, my friends
00:29:55
or anything that just it was kind of had to do
00:29:57
with me like Because my friends, you know, they
00:29:59
don't care that you know I'm changed now like
00:30:01
they still still hang out with me still do all
00:30:04
this You know, I'm just I'm no longer making
00:30:07
those digs anymore so that's That's the lesson,
00:30:12
huh that they still like you no matter what exactly,
00:30:15
you know, like you might think That you need
00:30:19
to put this facade up that you know, nothing
00:30:21
affects you You know, you're too cool or the
00:30:24
exact opposite like, you know Because I don't
00:30:26
know about the other end of the spectrum, but
00:30:28
there might be friend groups where it's like
00:30:30
You know you try and act overly happy about something
00:30:35
that you don't like because everyone else in
00:30:37
your group likes it so you know being your true
00:30:41
self and conflicting with your friends is more
00:30:45
important than Trying to be their they're like
00:30:48
robot because you know, no one no one wants to
00:30:51
hang out with Like it's called a yes, man. No
00:30:54
one wants to hang out with a yes, man because
00:30:56
it's like well some people do but you're never
00:30:58
gonna be close friends with a yes, man because
00:31:01
all they're ever gonna do is agree with you and
00:31:04
agree with your opinions and that's kind of the
00:31:07
thing that Kind of lacked was that I didn't like
00:31:13
when others Disagree with my opinions because
00:31:15
I didn't want to disagree with others opinions
00:31:17
and I didn't care about disagreeing with others
00:31:18
opinions It was something I was passionate about
00:31:21
but it's like I would never fully disagree with
00:31:25
like my girlfriend's opinions because I didn't
00:31:27
want to Hurt her in a way, I guess but it's like
00:31:31
when she disagreed with my opinions It was kind
00:31:34
of the same thing, but I would take it a lot
00:31:36
more to heart which is you know something we
00:31:39
can talk about later on about like why I would
00:31:41
do that, but it's It was a lot more personal
00:31:43
than I even realized like why I felt the way
00:31:46
I felt about certain things That I didn't even
00:31:49
know back then so it's like, you know everything
00:31:52
Your true self will find you like that That's
00:31:55
the end of the day thing is like you will find
00:31:58
who you're supposed to be. You know, you might
00:31:59
be 40 when you figure it out and then have a
00:32:02
midlife crisis, which you know isn't the best
00:32:05
but you know, you will Like everything takes
00:32:09
time like not trying to be like preachy but you
00:32:13
know there is a path that you're supposed to
00:32:15
be on and like a destiny and everything happens
00:32:18
for That reason and you know, I could never imagine
00:32:23
losing her Losing her but it's like that helped
00:32:27
me figure out, you know, I didn't like who I
00:32:29
was becoming I didn't like what I was doing with
00:32:32
my time because it was like a lot of my time
00:32:35
during lunch when I should have been you know
00:32:37
doing other things I was you know making fun
00:32:41
of others or you know I'm not trying to be like
00:32:43
the mean kid you know I didn't make fun of that
00:32:44
many people what it was like you know like just
00:32:46
a little insults like if someone did something
00:32:49
dumb or like tripped on the patio like we would
00:32:51
kind of make fun of that a little bit you know
00:32:52
just like as teenage boys do It surprises me
00:32:57
though because I know you as You know pretty
00:33:01
sweet and and you know, yes, we're all sarcastic
00:33:04
in our family, right? But I am surprised by that.
00:33:08
But like you said teenage boys, right and I I
00:33:11
get that I was never like never like makes it
00:33:14
worse actually it was never to their face like
00:33:16
we wouldn't it's like we would like go up and
00:33:18
point and laugh at them, but it'd be like the
00:33:20
the little snarky comments You didn't really
00:33:24
answer it, you said we'd get to it later, but
00:33:26
I am interested if you know, you may not, why
00:33:31
you felt the need to put up such a facade. I
00:33:37
mean, obviously we can kind of Freud it out a
00:33:41
second, you know, like you had a lot of stuff
00:33:43
happen in your family, right? But do you think
00:33:47
that that's a part of it? Do you think that...
00:33:50
You were doing it beforehand. Like maybe when
00:33:53
your mom got sick, like what do you think? I
00:33:56
felt like I always wanted to be Like that kid
00:34:00
I didn't want I didn't want to be you know, like
00:34:03
the the sad kid or the yeah the sad kid So I
00:34:07
felt like I always put up this this front that
00:34:10
I was, you know And I never wanted to be the
00:34:12
dumb kid either and I'm not dumb, but and I didn't
00:34:15
try Lot in my first few years of high school.
00:34:18
I just had a lot going on so you know I didn't
00:34:21
get the grades that my friends were getting even
00:34:24
though I Looking back like especially from this
00:34:27
junior year how I've been doing you know I definitely
00:34:29
could have I could have gotten amazing grades,
00:34:31
but I didn't For some reason I didn't care about
00:34:36
that and I think that had a lot to do with you
00:34:38
know my dad didn't finish college and he's one
00:34:43
of the most successful people I know, you know,
00:34:46
he does all this this like Just has a lot and
00:34:51
you know, I I look at that and i'm like I looked
00:34:53
at that and i'm like, you know, I don't need
00:34:54
to finish college either I don't you know, I
00:34:56
would I always wanted to finish college but I
00:34:58
was like, you know If he didn't need to try I
00:35:00
don't need to try and I could be just as successful
00:35:01
but it's like That's not how it works. You know,
00:35:04
i'm not trying to say that he got lucky but because
00:35:07
he worked his ass off for it, but you know It
00:35:10
does take that it does actually working for and
00:35:13
I didn't Didn't work for it and I didn't try
00:35:16
so, you know, that's kind of where that came
00:35:19
from but back to the main point it's like I Put
00:35:22
that wall up because I still wanted to seem as
00:35:26
smart as I actually was I still wanted to seem
00:35:28
like I was in par in line with everyone else
00:35:32
and So I lied a lot about you know, my grades
00:35:37
to my friends. I lied about You know how things
00:35:41
were at home just cuz you know Never wanted to
00:35:44
be the main thing when my mom got sick I didn't
00:35:48
want to be the the cancer kid and I didn't want
00:35:51
people to look at me and be like Oh his mom has
00:35:53
cancer like feel bad for him, you know feel feel
00:35:57
the certain way for him I wanted people to like
00:35:59
me For you know, not even who I was because I
00:36:02
kind of put up like a fake about who I was but
00:36:05
One of you would like see me and be like, oh
00:36:08
he's doing perfect. You know, he's He never had
00:36:12
anything wrong happen to him and you know, a
00:36:15
lot of people did think that so it it worked
00:36:18
because you know a lot of people when You know
00:36:22
just over these past few years of high school
00:36:24
and I kind of stopped putting up that front,
00:36:26
you know and like I started to know a lot more
00:36:29
people and I started become friends with people
00:36:32
that I didn't know before, you know They looked
00:36:35
at me when I would you know break down in front
00:36:37
of them not even break down But like just get
00:36:39
emotional about certain things and you know,
00:36:41
they'd be like, you know Why are you so emotional
00:36:43
about this? Like you've never had to deal with
00:36:44
that like I remember one of my one of my not
00:36:47
even their friends now but you know that we weren't
00:36:50
that close back then he was talking about you
00:36:53
know, it was a jersey number and soccer and you
00:36:57
know, I just lost my mom and she had always worn
00:37:00
number five and He took number five because he
00:37:04
was a senior and I was like I need to wear that
00:37:07
number for soccer season this year and he was
00:37:10
like You know like why like you can have it next
00:37:12
year and I was like, yeah But I kind of want
00:37:14
to wear it like it means a lot to me and he was
00:37:17
like Like what did you like get your first phone
00:37:20
when you were five or something, you know Just
00:37:21
kind of making fun of like oh my life's been
00:37:24
perfect. You know, nothing is nothing has happened
00:37:26
to me because that's that's who I Wanted to be
00:37:29
I wanted to be the kid that you know That's who
00:37:32
you projected. Yeah, I wanted to be the kid that,
00:37:34
you know, went to private schools all life. And
00:37:36
I don't even know why. I just wanted to I wanted
00:37:37
to be like the like the rich kid, I guess, like
00:37:40
the one that's never had like the nepo baby.
00:37:43
And I don't know why, but it's like and I definitely
00:37:47
am, you know, a rich kid. I'm never going to
00:37:49
say that I'm not. I'm definitely spoiled as well.
00:37:52
But I wanted to. This is true. I wanted to be
00:37:56
that kid. And it's like. You know, I had to tell
00:37:58
him I had to be like, you know, my mom wore that
00:38:00
number and he was like Like okay, like you can
00:38:04
wear it for her next year. I was like, they know
00:38:06
barely my mom passed away like I need to wear
00:38:08
that number and he was like Yo, bro, I'm so sorry.
00:38:10
Like I wouldn't I would have never guessed that
00:38:12
and it's like those are the things that you know,
00:38:15
like really just told me that you know, the facade
00:38:17
is working like keep this up keep this acting
00:38:20
because it's like Nobody knows who you truly
00:38:23
are and it's it's it's way easier that way. Okay,
00:38:26
but wait It's working you say but then when you
00:38:30
told the guy that had the number five that you
00:38:33
needed it and why? Did that feel okay? It actually
00:38:40
felt really uncomfortable, you know, I I felt
00:38:43
like There's a lot of there's like a thing called
00:38:46
trauma dumping and I feel like whenever I open
00:38:49
up That's what I feel like happens, you know,
00:38:51
even when I'm speaking to friends about you know,
00:38:53
just like You know my girlfriend or something
00:38:56
like that Like I just felt like I was trauma
00:38:59
dumping or like when I would speak about how
00:39:01
sad I was like that my family kind of drifted
00:39:04
apart and everything like that like I just felt
00:39:07
instead of Easier instead of it kind of relieving
00:39:11
some of it. I felt like I was putting a weight
00:39:15
onto them in a way that it's like Felt bad because
00:39:20
all I was doing was Yeah trauma dumping I was
00:39:24
like making them sad and making them kind of
00:39:27
quote -unquote Uncomfortable in a way because
00:39:29
you know a lot of people don't know what to say
00:39:31
back to that not not trying to like diss them
00:39:34
but it's like a lot of people wouldn't know if
00:39:36
I just went up to my boys now like obviously
00:39:39
they would know what to say but if I just went
00:39:40
up to like one of my friends and just started
00:39:43
like telling them everything, you know, they're
00:39:45
probably just gonna be like I'm so sorry and
00:39:47
I'm here for you. I feel you, you know, I'm here
00:39:50
if you need to talk which is like the most That's
00:39:52
another auto response people have is like when
00:39:54
someone is going through something It's always
00:39:58
the same three like I'm sorry I'm here for you.
00:40:02
And if you ever need anything like talk to me
00:40:05
Do you think that it made you feel worse because
00:40:08
it was such an un it was such a foreign way of
00:40:12
being to you because you had this you know that
00:40:14
chainmail right like you had been wearing it
00:40:16
for so long do you think that was part of it
00:40:20
and also when your ex was your girlfriend you
00:40:26
didn't think that you could talk to her about
00:40:29
that like let's just say that specific story
00:40:31
about the number five um you know i always talked
00:40:34
to her about it but not in a way that actually
00:40:39
helped me you know it'd be like I'd be mad or
00:40:42
when I'd be You know upset about something, you
00:40:46
know, I'd bring that up. I'd be like, you know
00:40:49
Or if I was just down, you know, I'd be like,
00:40:52
you know, my life kind of sucks right now And
00:40:54
it's like she's like, oh don't say that and then
00:40:57
I would just rattle everything off And that was
00:41:00
never was never healthy because it's like that
00:41:02
didn't help me do anything and actually made
00:41:04
it more Unhealthy in a way because it's like
00:41:08
All I would do is was try and use that to prove
00:41:11
a point instead of to like actually Get it off
00:41:15
my chest and to start healing about it. It was
00:41:17
it was to to kind of help me win that argument
00:41:22
in a way it was never an argument, but like It
00:41:25
was like the I love you more game. It's like
00:41:27
I was I was winning that in a way Between you
00:41:31
and her between me and her And it was never you
00:41:35
know, she was she was actually amazing about
00:41:38
it all like, you know She was like she didn't
00:41:40
do the auto response like, you know, I'm here
00:41:42
for you. I'm sorry It was like she would let
00:41:45
me speak about it. She'd be like like Jackson
00:41:47
like you your family is so amazing and how they
00:41:52
and how they You know kind of still kind of stick
00:41:55
together for you Even if it's not in the same
00:41:58
way it was before, you know they're still together
00:42:01
for you and it's like I never kind of realized
00:42:04
when she would say that and I would because I'd
00:42:08
be I'd be so mad I'd be so mad at them I'd be
00:42:10
so mad at everything and it's like I Should have
00:42:12
just well, there's a lot of I coulda woulda shoulda
00:42:15
so I'm not even gonna go down that path But you
00:42:18
know if I did listen to her more and if I did
00:42:22
You know kind of be more in touch with my feelings,
00:42:25
you know Most likely we'd still be together,
00:42:28
but then most likely, you know, I might not have
00:42:31
realized I didn't like the nonchalantness, so.
00:42:35
Well, yeah, I mean, coulda, shoulda, right? Like
00:42:38
I said, we don't know. It seems to me that, I
00:42:42
don't know if this is a family trait, but it's
00:42:46
easier to be in touch with an anger emotion than
00:42:50
it is, or happy, right? Than it is for sadness,
00:42:55
fear, like we don't seem to. Like those emotions
00:43:00
so much we're not so comfortable with yeah, yeah
00:43:03
No, not blaming anyone because you know, it is
00:43:07
my fault but you know for the first I don't know
00:43:12
14 years of my life the only emotion I kind of
00:43:17
really ever saw from anyone was Anger in a way
00:43:22
because you know besides when My grandma passed
00:43:28
away when people were sad. It's like That that's
00:43:33
kind of the only time I ever saw My dad be sad
00:43:39
and you know, that's It's not his fault. That's
00:43:43
not it's not my fault either. It's it's no one's
00:43:45
fault that it was like that, but it's like You
00:43:48
know, I didn't I didn't grow up and a lot of
00:43:51
boys. I feel like don't grow up learning To be
00:43:54
sad to be in touch with your emotions like that's
00:43:58
not really who I guess quote -unquote men are
00:44:01
is like to be sad, but it's like You know if
00:44:05
that had happened it, you know, I don't know
00:44:08
who I would have been today, but it's like You
00:44:12
would be a lot more in touch with sadness if
00:44:15
you're shown sadness from a young age because
00:44:17
you pick up a lot of traits From your parents
00:44:20
and you know my parents Love all of them, but
00:44:23
you know they didn't have the most healthy relationships
00:44:26
at time. There's a lot of Arguing a lot of yelling
00:44:30
a lot of bickering and a lot of digs at each
00:44:32
other and that that's kind of what I picked up
00:44:35
on instead of you know when they would Rekindle
00:44:38
and when they would be sad together and try and
00:44:41
fix things I wouldn't see that I wouldn't be
00:44:43
there for that because they would they wouldn't
00:44:44
want their kids to see that but it's like all
00:44:47
I would see is that bickering so I'm like Okay,
00:44:49
that's how I display my emotions. That's how
00:44:51
I That's how I do everything is I need to show
00:44:56
no emotion unless it's anger unless it's trying
00:44:59
to put a dig at someone else and winning that
00:45:01
argument winning that fight when it's really
00:45:03
you know, you're You know, it's just like a common
00:45:07
quote, but it's like you're never in a fight
00:45:09
With or against your partner. You're always in
00:45:13
a fight with your partner Because you got to
00:45:15
work it out together. You got to be there together.
00:45:17
You got to fix it together instead of it takes
00:45:20
two. Exactly. You know, it takes the two. Yeah,
00:45:23
because like you could you could put 100 percent
00:45:26
into a relationship, but if they're putting zero
00:45:28
percent, it's always going to be zero percent
00:45:30
no matter what you put in. If they're putting
00:45:33
in zero, then it's never going to equate to anything.
00:45:37
That's right. Do you think that you put in? Less
00:45:42
than your ex -girlfriend because you weren't
00:45:46
being the real you Did you know you weren't being
00:45:50
the real you like sometimes? I think you vacillate
00:45:53
like maybe maybe that the the real you got lost
00:45:56
under the performance you at all times Yeah,
00:45:59
honestly, I would say You know, I definitely
00:46:02
feel like she put More effort in than me a lot
00:46:07
of the time, you know No matter what it was,
00:46:10
you know if I was Upset or emotional, you know,
00:46:12
I would always be there for her. I'd always let
00:46:14
her talk. I'd always let her have her time, but
00:46:16
it's like When I would know when I would be upset
00:46:20
it would be a lot more of her trying to help
00:46:24
me But when she was upset, you know, it would
00:46:27
be a lot more of you know, why do you feel this
00:46:29
way? Like do you think never it was never like
00:46:33
a I don't know. I feel like I'm losing it but
00:46:35
it's like She just put more time and effort into
00:46:39
it than I would and I just think that was kind
00:46:41
of like our personalities You know, she would
00:46:43
always want maybe she explored of the reasons
00:46:46
why you were more upset like trying to help you
00:46:49
Solve it or figure it out where you were like,
00:46:52
well, um kind of in a way I mean, you know neither
00:46:56
of us knew and that's kind of the hardest part
00:46:59
is neither of us knew Why I would get because
00:47:02
I got upset a bunch of little things, you know,
00:47:04
it was never There was never a big argument between
00:47:07
us. It was little petty ones that would turn
00:47:09
into big arguments that would turn into little
00:47:12
stuff like kind of just like let's say one night
00:47:15
she would want to go out with her friends or
00:47:18
something like that and I would want to spend
00:47:20
time in and I felt like if she went out she was
00:47:24
choosing them over me and I felt that way because
00:47:28
you know, I didn't want to be abandoned and I
00:47:30
didn't want to be chosen over because you know,
00:47:33
no offense to my dad, but he chose Other things
00:47:40
over my sister in a way that you know kind of
00:47:43
kind of wrecked me because no matter what I did
00:47:46
no matter what I tried to do for them, you know,
00:47:49
I never brought them back together and What I
00:47:52
realized is they just needed time and they have
00:47:54
come back together. They've rekindled and that's
00:47:56
great, but it's like I kind of never never realized
00:48:01
that and never realized that you know this time
00:48:04
is actually good that we're spending apart because
00:48:07
I'm learning so much about myself and like why
00:48:11
I don't like those petty arguments and why I
00:48:14
felt like I was getting abandoned because you
00:48:16
know my mom passed away and I felt like she abandoned
00:48:19
us and you know just kind of the whole family
00:48:22
split I feel like it was abandoning you know
00:48:25
my childhood in a way so by her doing that You
00:48:29
know the most normal thing, you know Just wanting
00:48:31
to hang out with friends because when I would
00:48:33
want to hang out with friends, you know It would
00:48:34
be a oh my god have so much fun and that's always
00:48:37
what I said to her i'd be like, okay Have so
00:48:39
much fun and then i'd replay it over and over
00:48:42
and over and over again in my head To the point
00:48:45
where it became toxic and to the point where
00:48:47
I became Angry because I would come to the abandonment
00:48:51
conclusion instead of the You know jackson. She
00:48:54
needs to have space. She needs to have fun. You
00:48:57
know, we're not 70 years old married like we're
00:49:00
not doing every single thing together like she
00:49:02
needs to still find out who she is and By me
00:49:07
doing that, you know, it pushed her further and
00:49:09
further and further away every single time That
00:49:12
I would get mad because you know, it wouldn't
00:49:14
even be like just getting mad. It would be like
00:49:17
Just being an asshole in general, you know I'd
00:49:20
I'd bring up past things that you know, I didn't
00:49:23
like when when the thing would happen, you know
00:49:26
It was just it was it was honestly like to be
00:49:29
completely honest. It was when I would get like
00:49:32
that a very very toxic relationship because it
00:49:36
was it was a lot of bickering instead of trying
00:49:39
to help it and You know the worst part about
00:49:42
it is for the longest time. I just thought Jackson,
00:49:47
why are you so angry? Why are you why are you
00:49:50
why can't you control your anger? Like do you
00:49:52
need to go to anger management and? When we did
00:49:55
break up that was one of the things I said that
00:49:57
you know I might try and do is go to anger management
00:50:00
because I didn't understand why I got mad and
00:50:04
why I got So mad to the point where I couldn't
00:50:08
even see it like that's that's the worst part
00:50:11
And you know that that hurt me every time She
00:50:14
said it was like it was like I was two different
00:50:17
people, you know that that's also how I saw it
00:50:19
is There was you know, normal Jackson how I am
00:50:22
right now and then there was like this angry
00:50:25
prideful Jackson that wouldn't let go until I
00:50:30
don't know it was never even an answer that I
00:50:32
was looking for wasn't an I'm sorry because an
00:50:34
I'm sorry wouldn't do anything with it like He
00:50:37
would like poke the bear for some reason. I was
00:50:39
like I would actually get like more and more
00:50:42
defensive and 30 minutes after the argument,
00:50:45
you know, I'd completely forget about it or I'd
00:50:48
have a good time at lunch with my friends or
00:50:50
something like that and You know, I would act
00:50:53
like nothing happened and and then I would I
00:50:55
would apologize I'd be like, you know, I'm so
00:50:57
sorry for how I just acted like, you know And
00:50:59
I hated myself for it and I never let her know
00:51:02
how much I hated myself for but you know, it
00:51:05
was It was one of the things that if I could
00:51:07
cut out about myself, and you know I wouldn't
00:51:09
cut it out now because I've learned to Kind of
00:51:12
control it and be better about it, but you know
00:51:15
I would have cut that out in a heartbeat and
00:51:17
not anything else that I didn't like about myself,
00:51:20
but it's like That just made me you know in a
00:51:23
way kind of a horrible boyfriend because it was
00:51:26
it was just non -stop And it was over the littlest
00:51:30
thing so you know Jackson There's a saying that
00:51:34
hurt people hurt people, you know, and I think
00:51:38
Everything that you just said about how your
00:51:42
parents communicated how You know the bickering
00:51:46
the sarcasm the fracture of your family That
00:51:49
and and then of course the ultimate the loss
00:51:52
of your mother You're hurt, you know, and I think
00:51:57
You know, I'm not a psychologist, but I do think
00:52:01
that You acted out and unfortunately you act
00:52:06
out on the wrong person, you know Yeah, I thought
00:52:08
it was I thought it was the easiest to because
00:52:11
I felt like she would always been there So, you
00:52:13
know, well you probably trusted her in the most
00:52:15
too Yeah, you hurt you hurt the people you love
00:52:17
the most because you love them the most and it's
00:52:19
like you feel the closest to them so you feel
00:52:22
like you can take it out on them which is never
00:52:24
the right thing to do but it's like because I
00:52:28
Loved her so much. I felt like I could Take out
00:52:33
my anger in a way on on her and you know never
00:52:35
physical because I would never do that but you
00:52:38
know Let's talk about your therapist for a second
00:52:43
your FF you said you made things that you act
00:52:47
like everything was fine I think you said to
00:52:49
me like oh you just sat there and brag about
00:52:50
yourself because you know everything was fine
00:52:53
and It was interesting to me that you didn't
00:52:57
have anything to talk to her about when everything
00:53:00
was fine But was it fine um You know speaking
00:53:07
directly about therapy right now. I if I'm gonna
00:53:11
be honest I used to think therapy was a joke.
00:53:14
I thought therapy was You know something that
00:53:17
they made up You know never it never helped me
00:53:20
because I was never me inside of therapy and
00:53:23
not that was the problem is instead of you know
00:53:28
buying in to therapy All I did was push it further
00:53:32
away and I did like an ego thing in therapy where
00:53:35
I just kind of stroked my own ego and made up
00:53:38
things about myself that were completely untrue
00:53:40
and You know looking back now. That's the reason
00:53:43
therapy never worked for me is because I made
00:53:46
up things To feel better about myself to look
00:53:49
better about myself Told her I was fine told
00:53:53
her I was okay told her you know, I'm happy and
00:53:56
I'm I'm fine. I'm doing well when You know honestly
00:54:01
looking back I probably did feel fine when I
00:54:05
would say that I probably did feel okay because
00:54:08
I never It's kind of hard to say I never mourned
00:54:12
My mom in a way. I never I never sat, you know
00:54:17
There was a few nights where I feel a very strong
00:54:20
connection and miss her greatly But I never on
00:54:23
the day that she passed. I didn't cry One time,
00:54:27
you know that the time that I did cry is when
00:54:30
she sat me down and told me that she was going
00:54:34
on hospice and would no longer be here in a few
00:54:38
months and That that night I you know, I walked
00:54:42
outside and I just I just sat outside on our
00:54:45
stairs crying for an hour so Until they came
00:54:50
and got me outside because of how long I had
00:54:53
been out there they thought I had like walked
00:54:55
away because they wanted to give me my space
00:54:57
and They came outside and I just I came back
00:55:02
in and every single time I Looked at my mom.
00:55:07
It was tears. I cried profusely because I knew
00:55:11
that I Was losing my best friend. So You know
00:55:17
That was the hardest night for me and after that
00:55:20
I kind of Dug myself into anything but her because
00:55:25
I couldn't accept the fact that you know, she
00:55:28
was passing and That was kind of the hardest
00:55:31
thing to look back on is I spent a lot of time
00:55:35
with a girl that I didn't really you know, I
00:55:39
cared about her, you know, and you know, it was
00:55:42
I didn't see a long future like how I saw with
00:55:46
my Previous girlfriend. I or my like the most
00:55:50
recent girlfriend. Yeah. Yeah and I saw a long
00:55:53
future there, but I didn't see a long future
00:55:55
with my last one you know, I told myself a few
00:55:57
times like are you just doing this as a coping
00:56:00
thing and Turns out I was because looking back
00:56:04
on it all I wish I did and I think she also knew
00:56:08
it but didn't didn't know how to tell me because
00:56:12
there was a few times that she was like She was
00:56:15
like Jackson like are you sure you want to hang
00:56:18
out today? Are you sure you don't want to spend
00:56:20
time with your mom and looking back like I told
00:56:23
her no I'm fine No, she'll show because I think
00:56:25
I was in denial in a way I was like I didn't
00:56:29
want to accept that that might have been the
00:56:31
last day that might have been the last week that
00:56:33
might have been the last month I wanted to Continue
00:56:37
on like everything was fine because you know
00:56:39
she was this one of the strongest woman or strongest
00:56:42
people I've ever known She fought so hard all
00:56:47
the time and it's um, but yeah, no, I feel like
00:56:50
this was a therapy question I'm just saying like
00:56:59
why you thought you know, you could I don't even
00:57:02
remember my question It was just something about
00:57:04
oh why couldn't why couldn't I like tell what
00:57:07
was really going on? Yeah. Yes. I don't know.
00:57:09
I just feel like it was easier to To fake it
00:57:13
like fake it to your make it it was easier to
00:57:16
act like everything was fine because that would
00:57:20
mean I could stop going to therapy if I acted
00:57:25
like everything was fine it meant no more therapy
00:57:28
and I hated therapy for some reason because I
00:57:32
found it like a pointless point of time and So
00:57:36
there was there was this big thing that I always
00:57:38
bring up when I speak about how I was in old
00:57:40
therapy where I told my therapist I You know
00:57:43
played basketball every day, and I was like most
00:57:46
dedicated I was like the greatest player of all
00:57:48
time basically because you know like everyone
00:57:50
does that everyone does you know? Hypes himself
00:57:53
up, but it went to a point where you know I told
00:57:56
her I would go to the gym Six times a week when
00:57:59
you know clearly by just looking at me you could
00:58:03
tell I didn't Go to the gym six times a week
00:58:06
and that was one of the biggest things I've changed
00:58:09
over the past year now i've i've gone to the
00:58:11
gym very consistently um five to six times a
00:58:16
week for a year straight now and it's it's been
00:58:19
the most dramatic increase of happiness in my
00:58:22
life because I look forward to the gym, you know
00:58:25
a lot of people say that Takes a lot for them
00:58:28
to go to the gym for me if I don't go to the
00:58:32
gym I don't have a good day and that's it's well
00:58:34
not it not even that I still have a good day,
00:58:36
but it's like a Gym is a very happy place for
00:58:40
me. Well, I mean chemically it gets your endorphins
00:58:44
going, right? It's good for your brain, right
00:58:48
to work off stress and and any emotion that you
00:58:54
might be feeling. And then also physically you
00:58:58
feel much better, right? So I could see why that
00:59:01
happens. And what you told the therapist that
00:59:05
wasn't exactly true, you actually made it come
00:59:08
true. So I mean, yeah, maybe it was just something
00:59:11
that you really wanted to be like. Yeah, I mean,
00:59:14
I told her that's a great point is I told her
00:59:17
everything I wanted to be like. I wanted to be,
00:59:21
you know, this Perfect student. I she thought
00:59:23
I was a genius, you know, I told her I went home
00:59:27
and I studied every night and I never I never
00:59:30
said that I played video games and back then
00:59:32
that's all I did it's all I did I would go home
00:59:35
from school and You know looking back it was
00:59:39
kind of bomb activities. I'd get home from school
00:59:42
After you know a practice or something. I would
00:59:45
door -dash fast food I would play video games
00:59:50
until I could barely keep my eyes open and then
00:59:53
wake up super tired in the morning and be late
00:59:56
to school every single day for basically my whole
01:00:00
freshman year and So that was a that was a big
01:00:03
problem is I would never study I would never
01:00:06
do anything because I just thought you know middle
01:00:07
school and lower school came very easy to me
01:00:11
because I'm not trying to brag but and I do have
01:00:15
a base level of intelligence that is Quite high.
01:00:18
So it's it was way easier to You know not do
01:00:23
anything in middle school in middle school My
01:00:25
grades were almost perfect and I never studied
01:00:28
for a single test. I never had to because You
01:00:32
know, I just I picked everything up so much quicker,
01:00:34
you know I was I was one of those kids in lower
01:00:37
school that just knew how to do like everything
01:00:40
while still being good at sports while still
01:00:42
Having a good friend group. So it was like I
01:00:45
never thought I would lose that and I lost that
01:00:47
because In middle school, I didn't prepare myself
01:00:51
for high school and then when I got to high school
01:00:53
And I actually did need to study. I didn't know
01:00:55
how to study. I didn't want to study All I wanted
01:00:57
to do is keep playing my video games. So I I
01:01:01
told my therapist that you know that I would
01:01:03
study every single night and I'd cook home cooked
01:01:06
meals and I was like a Pro chef and you know,
01:01:09
i'm still not even a good chef. I know how to
01:01:10
cook like maybe ground beef and everyone knows
01:01:13
how to cook your own beef, so. Not everybody,
01:01:16
not everybody. There's a researcher named, his
01:01:20
last name is Pennebaker, and he talks about the
01:01:24
long -term emotional toll on performing fine,
01:01:31
right? The suppressed emotions cause stress.
01:01:35
They cause your health to be compromised. The
01:01:42
worst part is your sense of self over time starts
01:01:46
to fade, right? And that's kind of like what
01:01:48
we've been talking about the entire time, right?
01:01:52
So I just think it stops you. And I think it's
01:01:55
very interesting that from this breakup, it's
01:02:00
what opened the door for you to say, I don't
01:02:05
want to be like this anymore. Yeah, it showed
01:02:07
me who I actually wanted to be. You know, it
01:02:10
came in the worst way, but you know, still grateful
01:02:13
for her. You know, I actually told her thank
01:02:14
you the other day when we had a little in -person
01:02:17
convo about maybe I think two weeks now ago.
01:02:22
And I just said like, you know, I never wanted
01:02:25
to lose you, but losing you showed me who I actually
01:02:29
wanted to be. So like, thank you for that. I
01:02:33
have two questions. With you just saying that
01:02:38
when your relationship ended I'm interested to
01:02:41
know how you physically felt in your body and
01:02:45
How you feel now? Um, you know that night was
01:02:49
um, you know opening up about this it isn't easy
01:02:54
especially because you know she might see it
01:02:57
later on or like a friend might see it, but I'm
01:03:00
not trying to be corny or anything. It's like
01:03:03
that night was harder Than losing, um my mom
01:03:08
in a way because it was I lost more than Just
01:03:12
like my girlfriend and I lost my best friend.
01:03:16
I lost my companion. I lost This person that
01:03:19
you know, we built our whole Lives together for
01:03:23
all a lot of our high school life together because
01:03:25
we started very start of sophomore year and To
01:03:30
lose her at the very end of junior year, you
01:03:32
know Everyone called us like the married couple
01:03:35
of our school, you know, like the mom and dad
01:03:38
and it was like, you know I kind of saw us as
01:03:40
that too. So that night Not being able to you
01:03:45
know and the days that followed not being able
01:03:48
to text her not being able to tell her everything
01:03:50
I was doing not being able to like get an update
01:03:53
not being able to Say hi not being able to hang
01:03:56
out. You know, it was it was extremely extremely
01:04:00
hard it felt like Well, I did I felt like I lost
01:04:05
a part of myself because You know you always
01:04:08
eat when you when you're with someone because
01:04:10
we were together for almost two years when you're
01:04:12
with someone for that long You're no longer just
01:04:16
You know, you're so you're yourself. You're you're
01:04:19
together You're a lot of your identity is built
01:04:21
with them, especially when you're in your formative
01:04:24
years So, you know going to any spot listening
01:04:27
to any music that we might have listened to I
01:04:29
couldn't there was a lot of movies that we had
01:04:32
watched together and you know I started this
01:04:35
thing with um my mom and my sister where we watch
01:04:39
a movie every night now because you know I just
01:04:42
just want to have fun wanna because I felt like
01:04:44
you know that was a big thing that I also realized
01:04:47
by the relationship ending was I didn't spend
01:04:49
enough time with the people that I loved including
01:04:52
you I feel like we don't spend enough time together
01:04:55
and You know, it's just like that's something
01:04:57
I'm very regretful about because I felt like
01:05:00
me and her didn't spend that much or as much
01:05:02
time as I wanted doing things that we should
01:05:04
have done like She what we wanted to do this
01:05:07
over summer. We were gonna start where it was
01:05:09
alphabet dating So we were gonna like go to the
01:05:12
aquarium and then a bowling alley until we got
01:05:15
all the way down to Z and You know just doing
01:05:19
all that and So I was looking forward to that.
01:05:22
So just, you know, when it ended, I kind of just
01:05:25
felt like my future collapsed as well because
01:05:29
my future, everything had her in it. So it was
01:05:33
harder to let that go in a way. So that night
01:05:38
and I felt horrible sat in my room for four hours
01:05:44
almost because we stopped talking at seven and
01:05:48
I didn't stop. You know sitting in my room until
01:05:51
almost 11 o 'clock just Just crying, you know,
01:05:56
that was the longest I've ever By the end, you
01:05:59
know didn't have tears left. It was just You
01:06:03
know everything and it was it was so sad and
01:06:06
then you know that weekend Was super hard going
01:06:10
to school the next day seeing her first thing
01:06:12
one of the hardest things I've ever had to do
01:06:15
But you know, it's it's gotten better It's got
01:06:18
a lot better still hurts to see her and not be
01:06:21
able to talk to her and I'll be able to do anything
01:06:23
but it's like you know, I am moving on slowly,
01:06:27
but surely and What's that moving on feel like
01:06:32
physically in your body? What's that feel? Oh,
01:06:34
it stings Honestly, that's that's the main thing
01:06:37
is it it stings because it's you know, no matter
01:06:40
how far I've moved on it. I always get a reminder
01:06:46
of her and like um last week whenever we would
01:06:50
even have a class together i'd get weak in the
01:06:52
knees from anxiety of just seeing her just you
01:06:57
know maybe the the hope of maybe you know she'll
01:07:00
realize that night like the night before or the
01:07:03
class before that she misses me so much and then
01:07:05
you know she talked to me all class and we'd
01:07:07
rekindle but you know that that's never going
01:07:10
to happen especially not now to give that a lot
01:07:13
of time and space but it's You know that that's
01:07:16
always what it was. It was the the anxiety and
01:07:19
the hope of everything so it that that's kind
01:07:22
of gone away not fully away, but you know I'm
01:07:26
a lot less hopeful of our relationship and that's
01:07:31
actually helped me a lot more because not not
01:07:35
continuing to like Continuing to have my brain
01:07:40
think about you know, oh You're gonna get her
01:07:45
back. You're gonna get her back. It's it's now
01:07:47
moved on to the You know, how are you gonna be
01:07:50
happy? How are how are you gonna make yourself
01:07:52
happy and it's still a lot harder there's an
01:07:55
artist that we that she actually like put me
01:07:58
on to called Olivia Dean and um III every time
01:08:04
I put on Olivia Dean song. It's kind of funny.
01:08:07
I start to get teary so I haven't been able to
01:08:10
actually listen to an Olivia Dean song but the
01:08:13
other night I was at my gym lifetime and and
01:08:18
Um, they were playing an Olivia Dean song I just
01:08:20
kind of sat there because you know we had been
01:08:22
to that gym a lot, you know She loved that gym.
01:08:25
She thought I was like the best gym ever and
01:08:27
you know just hearing that song just made so
01:08:31
many memories come back and You know, honestly,
01:08:34
that's kind of what it is now is instead of a
01:08:37
painful sting. It's a happy It's a happy sting,
01:08:40
you know made all those memories together made
01:08:42
everything together and you know, maybe We might
01:08:46
not ever be together again, but it's you know
01:08:50
Everything was happy, you know that when it was
01:08:52
good You know, that was some of the greatest
01:08:55
moments that i've had in life was when When me
01:08:59
and her were extremely happy together, you know
01:09:01
It might have been like for example those late
01:09:04
night runs to get yoga fina or It's called yogurt
01:09:07
park and then like grizzly peak and just watching
01:09:10
the sunset was just like just so much fun. Yeah
01:09:13
absolutely, um the We'll have two questions the
01:09:20
alphabet dating i'm wondering what you would
01:09:22
have done for x But that's you know, you can
01:09:24
tell me that later. But anyways, um I asked you
01:09:29
how you felt because I know in your body physically
01:09:32
because I know that like first love real love
01:09:35
like like young love how about that young love
01:09:38
is almost like an addiction it it actually stimulates
01:09:44
the same reward patterns that drugs do like it
01:09:49
boosts the dopamine and so I think sometimes
01:09:53
that's why it hurts so much. Don't even think
01:09:57
that I know it it's it's actually research. There's
01:10:01
evidence of it that the word heartbreak is a
01:10:05
physical Reaction to breaking up. Yeah, so I'm
01:10:11
glad to hear that It's it's not as Devastating
01:10:15
as it was a month ago, right that it's a little
01:10:18
less. It still stings, right? We get that we
01:10:21
get that so So You know, you and I are close
01:10:29
right? We have a lot of fun together But you've
01:10:33
never spoken to me like this or maybe many people
01:10:37
you've never spoken to like this and What does
01:10:42
it feel like to finally just say all of it out
01:10:46
loud? Um, honestly, it feels a lot better than
01:10:50
it was before and for anyone listening like You
01:10:54
know, you might not have a lot of people that
01:10:55
you feel comfortable opening up with and you
01:10:58
know I didn't either even though how many like
01:11:00
so many people told me, you know Open up to me
01:11:03
whenever it's like you might not feel comfortable
01:11:05
doing that and you might not feel comfortable
01:11:07
doing anything But I'm telling you like when
01:11:10
I first Reached out to Annie and just started
01:11:13
talking about everything and I didn't feel exactly
01:11:16
comfortable opening up like that because I'd
01:11:19
never done that before but You know after the
01:11:21
first time, you know, you just it becomes more
01:11:24
comfortable. It comes, you know easier and then
01:11:27
now I catch myself opening up to like everyone
01:11:29
so I do kind of have to dial it back a little
01:11:33
bit, but it's like You know everyone if you have
01:11:37
a good friend group where you have people that
01:11:39
care and support about you They will listen and
01:11:43
I didn't I used to not think that either But
01:11:46
you know, they will be there for you. They will
01:11:48
listen to you They will hear out your problems,
01:11:50
even if they don't have an answer, you know,
01:11:52
sometimes just just talking will be great because
01:11:56
When we'd first broken up, you know, I think
01:11:58
I told Annie 25 times. How do I kid her back?
01:12:02
What do I do? What do I say? And you know Annie
01:12:04
didn't have a set answer because no one has a
01:12:06
set answer but it's like Just being able to speak
01:12:09
about that made it so much easier because it's
01:12:11
like, you know, Annie would be like I don't know
01:12:13
but you know Try breathing try doing this and
01:12:17
it helped a lot and it's like no one is ever
01:12:20
going to be My ex so they're not gonna know what
01:12:22
she wants what she's gonna say and nothing like
01:12:25
that, but it's it's a lot easier To go through
01:12:29
life with someone else by your side that you
01:12:32
know, you could talk to Then you know having
01:12:35
everything inside of my inside of your head Yeah,
01:12:39
where you can just like you talked about like
01:12:41
ruminating over and over again, you know, it's
01:12:43
that's the worst unhealthy and so Debilitating
01:12:48
I think you know super super debilitating. So
01:12:52
All right, so If you could go back Not to change
01:12:59
things change things but just to be more honest
01:13:02
and vulnerable What do you wish people had actually
01:13:07
seen? About you like that you would kept hidden.
01:13:11
I think the biggest thing that I kept hidden
01:13:14
that I wish I didn't was like my love for certain
01:13:18
things or like the ability I had to have fun
01:13:23
because um, I feel like with the nonchalantness
01:13:26
that I kind of kept it hidden like about my truth
01:13:30
the nonchalantness that made me keep myself hidden
01:13:33
was a lot of like fun like for example the assembly
01:13:37
or You know just her asking to do a lot of things
01:13:42
and me saying no because uh I don't know. I don't
01:13:47
know. I just thought they were like kind of Weird
01:13:49
to do, you know, like I wish we went on a lot
01:13:52
more of the fun dates That that's the thing that
01:13:55
I would go back and change drastically is Saying
01:14:00
yes more, you know, that's that's the biggest
01:14:04
thing think is it's the biggest life lesson I've
01:14:07
learned is to say yes more because You know saying
01:14:10
yes at the assembly made me have a blast saying
01:14:13
yes to The hangouts my friends when I would normally
01:14:16
just sit at home and play on my my video games
01:14:19
because I was like my downtime You know, but
01:14:21
saying yes actually allowed me to have more fun
01:14:25
and have Deeper connections like there was one
01:14:29
of my boys. That's like I didn't used to be as
01:14:31
close with but now i'm a lot closer with happened
01:14:34
because You know, I just started saying yes more
01:14:37
and then I started seeing him more and I started
01:14:39
like hanging out more and Now we're now i'm not
01:14:42
gonna say we're super tight But you know, we
01:14:44
talk a lot like we're we're good friends and
01:14:47
you know, like he's my boy He also just lost
01:14:50
his girlfriend. So we've been speaking through
01:14:53
that but you know, like we're we're tight Yeah,
01:14:56
like that's kind of how it started and then you
01:14:59
know, we just kind of realized that We do have
01:15:01
a lot more in common than you know, we thought
01:15:04
right right It's nice to make a new friend, you
01:15:07
know, especially one that you bond with over.
01:15:10
Yeah, and you know, we had always been Friendly
01:15:14
and you know joked around but you know now I
01:15:16
truly think of him like as a as a good friend
01:15:19
You know, I just thought of him as like, you
01:15:21
know, that's my friend, you know, like I'm boys
01:15:23
with him But like now I'm like, you know, that's
01:15:25
like actually my boy like yeah I think as we
01:15:30
come to a close on this. I think the one thing
01:15:34
that I want to say is that your realization of
01:15:40
that persona that you were putting on, that mask
01:15:45
that you were putting on, I think you're figuring
01:15:48
out why you've done it. I don't think you totally
01:15:50
know. And to be truthful with you, I don't know
01:15:54
if you'll know right now everything. I think
01:15:59
if you keep on the path of the reflection that
01:16:02
you're doing, the work that you're doing with
01:16:04
the FF, and just speaking and not being afraid
01:16:09
to be vulnerable, not being afraid to not be
01:16:12
cool, man, I don't know. I think that some of
01:16:17
your realizations are going to really help you
01:16:21
move forward through life. I'm always here for
01:16:25
you. I Mean that you know, I mean that I hope
01:16:28
you know, I mean, yeah, I hope you do. Yeah,
01:16:31
but is there anything else that you would like
01:16:36
To say about what you've learned or how you feel
01:16:41
about anything I don't know. I feel like I've
01:16:45
said a lot of my key points that I've been thinking
01:16:47
about but it's like it really is the But there's
01:16:53
this quote. It's like it's better to Leave a
01:16:58
flower and watch it bloom than it is to pick
01:17:01
the flower and watch it die and it's like it's
01:17:05
a lot easier to You know stop trying to self
01:17:10
-care and because you think you you've done it
01:17:13
all you think you know, you're that flower that's
01:17:15
super pretty but if you let yourself, you know
01:17:19
stay and Stay in the dirt and continue to work
01:17:22
on yourself It's only going to better you because
01:17:26
it's you know, there's i've never heard of anyone
01:17:29
that said self -improvement Didn't help them.
I've never no one's ever said, you know, I wish
I hadn't self -improved I wish I hadn't spent
01:17:38
more time on myself, you know, I feel like a
01:17:40
lot of people Look back and they say man. I wish
01:17:43
I spent more time with with my own thoughts.
01:17:47
I wish I Spend my time, you know bettering myself
01:17:52
instead of throwing myself into other actions
01:17:54
because it's like All anybody wants to do is
01:18:00
be that perfect person and the only way and no
01:18:03
one's ever gonna be perfect but the only way
01:18:04
that you're going to be a person that you truly
01:18:07
like is to Work on yourself enough to where you
01:18:11
don't have many insecurities and that's a big
01:18:14
thing as well as like insecurities Stop me from
01:18:17
doing a lot of things. You know, I was insecure
01:18:19
about how people thought about me I was insecure
01:18:20
about how I looked how I I always because Growing
01:18:24
up and I was an athlete in lower school and then
01:18:28
covid hit And I put on like 30 40 pounds straight
01:18:33
in my stomach It was not that much Well, I gained
01:18:37
a lot of weight and I became very skinny fat
01:18:39
and very insecure about how I looked and So getting
01:18:44
that back Kind of helped me a lot, but I realized
01:18:49
you know, it didn't help me in the best way because
01:18:52
it made me You know, I never have a huge ego
01:18:57
because I still don't think I actually have a
01:18:59
very small ego when it comes to that because
01:19:01
I still don't think I'm anywhere where I Should
01:19:03
have an ego, you know, but it's it's a lot it's
01:19:08
a lot healthier because I just feel healthier
01:19:10
at all times like a Biggest biggest thing as
well. Just speaking on that is like cutting soda
out with no soda It's been a game changer. I
just feel like I'm A lot happier all the time.
That might just be a placebo, but you know. Oh
no, no, it's sugar. It's addicting. Yeah, yeah,
absolutely. That's the next podcast. We'll talk
about your diet, okay? Well, when you said that
you're the flower in the dirt that keeps staying
there through the rain, through everything and
01:19:40
not getting pulled out, I just thought of a little
01:19:42
sunflower or a large sunflower, because you're
01:19:45
very tall, and just blooming. Over and over.
01:19:50
Yeah, there's there's never been a harvest without
01:19:52
a rain. So exactly. I like it. Well, you're wise.
01:19:57
Seventeen year old young man. Thank you. I really
01:19:59
appreciate you being on this and I love you so
01:20:02
much. And I'm giving him hugs now. And it was
01:20:06
it was a blast being on this and being able to,
01:20:08
you know, speak to this and I'd be so happy to
01:20:11
come back any time. I don't know what what other
01:20:12
podcasts I could do. But, you know, I love speaking
01:20:15
about my feelings now. And it's honestly been
01:20:17
a it's been a great time, you know. Thank you
01:20:20
so much. I want to sit with you for a moment
01:20:25
before we close. I think what we just heard was
01:20:31
a 17 -year -old boy doing something that took
01:20:33
me decades to approach. He told the truth. He
01:20:39
let himself be seen. Not perfectly, not without
01:20:44
hesitation, but he did it. fascinated by that
01:20:50
at just his, I think, confidence, you know, maybe
01:20:55
he doesn't think he has it. But I think that
took a lot to be that honest. I keep thinking
about what finally cracked him open. It wasn't
the devastating loss of his mother, although
I do know that that's underneath everything.
It wasn't even the fracture of his family, which
I know completely changed everything for him,
but I don't know, it was the girl who loved him
enough to tell him the truth about what she needed
from him and wasn't getting. And I think losing
her finally made him stop performing. And I hope
01:21:38
it sticks. I think we don't realize what the
performance cost us until you know, something
we love is gone. Before we recorded, I told my
nephew, don't be like me. Don't spend years building
a persona. Because you think people won't love
who you really are. I'm not sure I have fully
learned that lesson myself, but Every time I
have let someone see the unpolished, you know,
the not always fine version of me, nothing terrible
has happened. Nobody left. And for a moment,
01:22:22
I felt lighter. That's what exists on the other
01:22:27
side of fine. Not weakness, not burden, just
01:22:33
the quiet relief of being known. Your original
01:22:37
self the version of you That version of you that
01:22:41
existed before you learned it was safer to perform
01:22:45
than to actually be seen It's still there It's
01:22:49
just waiting for you to decide if it's worth
01:22:51
the risk worth the risk of letting someone in
01:22:56
I'm starting to believe it is and I believe that
01:23:02
you're worth the risk So I'll leave you with
01:23:05
a reflection question and that is who in your
01:23:09
life would make time for your truth But you still
01:23:14
keep giving them fine instead What would it cost
01:23:19
you to tell them one real thing this week just
01:23:23
one honest feeling Think about that think about
01:23:27
who that would be Thank you for listening to
01:23:31
the original self podcast if today's conversation
01:23:35
Resonated with you and you feel ready to explore
01:23:38
your own growth You can learn more about working
01:23:41
with me at decotalifecoaching.com I'll see
01:23:46
you next time
